Hardiest "true" Yucca tree

MCKATELYN · Post by **MCKATELYN** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:22 am

Im new to this forum but have always loved the desert and have quite a large cactus/yucca collection. I live in a very solid zone 5 ( right on rim of 5a and 5b). I'm just outside of Chicago but sufficiently inland to not get much lake effect microclimate. My desert garden is along the south side of my house with a pretty large overhang to give good sun but also rain protection. I have a couple potted yuccas that come in for the winter ( nice sized rostrata and large thompsoniana). Outside and unprotected, I have Y baccata, glauca, flaccid, filamentosa, gloriosa (cold damaged a couple yrs ago but lots of babies), recurvafloria ( normally gets some leaf damage in winter but always pulls through), and a elata. All of those Yuccas have been in the ground for about 10 years and other then a good microclimate Against my house, received no winter protection. Some of those form a very small trunk but the only one I would really say is a tree forming one is the elata. With my placement and amount of time in ground, I would call elata a solid zone 5 yucca. It has gotten eaten back to ground several winters by rabbits but hasn't gotten cold killed back. I just checked out a book today at liberty called "Hardy Succents" that has lots of great information. It lists elata as hardy to zone 5 but lists Thompsoniana as zone 4 hardy. Does anyone know what the hardiest "true" tree Yucca is? My thompsoniana is about 4 feet tall and wasn't cheap so I'm a little scared to risk planting it in the ground but now am considering taking the plunge. I know there are lots of people on here growing things above there limits with winter protection or a few lucky warm winters. I was just curios if it's the elata or thompsoniana that is the hardiest tree yucca ;- )

Paul Ont · Post by **Paul Ont** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:44 am

In my experience Y. elata (the hardiest forms) will be the most hardy trunking Yucca. Y. thompsoniana has never survived more than 2 winters in my garden (z.4b/5a). Of course, my winters can hit -30C, so maybe you'll have better luck... Oh, and select Yucca gloriosa have done much better than thompsoniana for me.

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 9:38 am

My guess would be that Y.Faxoniana(rz5) would be in there too,right?

http://coldhardycactus.com/Pages/YU005.htm

Y.Torreyi rz5

http://www.yuccaagavaceae.com/torreyi.jpg

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:43 am

I think everyone here is right, but I think it has alot to do with how you plant it and where. Never give up, if one dies it does not mean that another one will. For me joshua trees are very hardy, as you can tell from my pics they are the only ones I have with trunks, but I dought they would hardy at all in the midwest.
Soap tree yuccas are very hardy, but when they are young they like to freeze back as do most tree yuccas, but they do very well when older. Plant yuccas high and keep the crowns dry in the winter and you will have much better luck.

There is some simi-dwarf trucking yuccas that will do good for you! Y. gluaca (some forms), Y.baccata? Yucca utahensis etc...

Paul Ont · Post by **Paul Ont** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:06 pm

Yuca glauca does the best around my palce, even better than filamentosa. The filamentosa will have occasional leaf damage, while glauca seems bullet-proof.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:21 pm

Welcome aboard, McKatelyn, looking forward to seeing your yucca photos.

Barb

MCKATELYN · Post by **MCKATELYN** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 3:59 pm

Thank you Barb, I still need to figure this whole posting pics thing out.lol I'm going to take a 2 day trip to Saugatuck MI next week. It's a mini trip because it's only a couple hrs away. It's a very warm zone 6b (I suspect really a 7a). Anyway, there is a unusually huge filamentosa thats foliage has to be more than 4 feet tall growing by the entrance to the city. I want to snap a couple shots of that yucca just to show how giant this specimen is. Btw, the book I was talking about does list faxoniana as hardy to zone 5. I have also heard the smaller leafed Joshual tree is extremely cold hardy but not in our climate with an average of 37 inches of rain per year.

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:50 pm

McKatelyn, I would buy smaller one gallon yuccas and try them through the winter. The bigger ones you have in the pots may not be worth the money too experiment with but in time the larger yuccas in the pots may stop growing/ or look weak in time (from what I seen).
I would forget about exact zone claims, I have seem thompsoniana freeze way before rostrata, but I think in many ways it depends on the plants as individuals. Some will just do better than even the same plants from the same batch of seeds.

PS I have not seen Yucca Faxon hardy in my garden without cover in winter, but they can vary greatly, so I keep trying. Maybe as mine gets bigger it will do better.

Also welcome aboard.

seedscanada · Post by **seedscanada** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 8:52 pm

I don't disagree with anyone. Welcome to palms north. My thompsonianas do way better than my rostratas in the winter. I am in zone 7a however.
How and where they are planted and the vigour of each plant plays a huge role. Dry and well drained in the winter with southern exposure sure can help.
My trunkers here have been in the ground three years or less.. they are trunking glauca, gloriosa variegata, & baccata. Many other of mine will trunk, just not yet.
I surely want to suggest Yucca elata 'Utahensis' as the possible hardiest trunker, besides trunking glauca. My utahensis yuccas are still babies, but may get one planted before fall. They are supposed to be good to zone 5a? davesgarden.com says good to 4a. Believe it when I see it.

Trunking yucca glauca:

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/seedscanada/7348602600/" title="Lincoln-20120607-00816 by seedscanada, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7237/7348 ... d5ab_z.jpg" width="480" height="640" alt="Lincoln-20120607-00816"></a>

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/seedscanada/7161355741/" title="IMG-20120404-00597 by seedscanada, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7076/7161 ... 4553_z.jpg" width="480" height="640" alt="IMG-20120404-00597"></a>

cheers!

MCKATELYN · Post by **MCKATELYN** » Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:01 pm

Thanks everyone for the warm welcome

When I planted my elata between 8 and 10 years ago, it was a 5 gal size. It has survived just fine (although it's not to vigorous probably due to much shade). That one was from a Arizona nursery that I don't think is in business anymore. Last year I planted a 1 gal size that I picked up cheap at a roadside nursery in Palm Springs. I also planted it one south side of house under house overhang for rain protection. It actually gets more sun than my old one and we had a really warm winter. Guess what, it didn't make it. It does make sence that the Utah ones would be much hardier since that has to be the northern limit for them. Do you know how tall that form gets at maturity or where they sell larger size ones? Thanks again

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:26 am

You might want too look for plants from New Mexico and West Texas nuresries, places where the plants may come from seed that have seen more cold.

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:27 am

Aaron is giving you some good advice there-but when it comes to what size plant to
buy,that is a tough one because the larger ones should be tougher than smaller ones
so you may have a better shot with a bigger plant but at great $$ risk.

Unfortunately I think Joshua trees don't like the mid-west/east to much
to much rain and humidity-well.....normally.

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:37 am

McKatelyn, any pics of your garden?

MCKATELYN · Post by **MCKATELYN** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:13 am

I will take some pics when I get some time. This is such an awesome forum

igor.glukhovtsev · Post by **igor.glukhovtsev** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:21 am

MCKATELYN wrote: This is such an awesome forum

That's why I'm spending a lot of time reading and enjoying! It has been making united many people through over North America, Europe and even Asia

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:37 am

MCKATELYN wrote:I will take some pics when I get some time. This is such an awesome forum

Yes, good friendly people here.

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Thu Jul 26, 2012 1:53 pm

igor.glukhovtsev wrote:
MCKATELYN wrote: This is such an awesome forum
That's why I'm spending a lot of time reading and enjoying! It has been making united many people through over North America, Europe and even Asia

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 9:52 am

oh oh, Jim's gonna run out of beer.

igor.glukhovtsev · Post by **igor.glukhovtsev** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:14 am

lucky1 wrote:oh oh, Jim's gonna run out of beer.

Nobody is gonna run out of beer ... feeling the ... sorry I'm drunk. I mean I feel Jim's.... I'm drunk.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Sat Jul 28, 2012 4:26 pm

Good to know you're enjoying your weekend, Igor

We're all practicing for the day we can sit UNDER our palms with a beer.

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Sun Jul 29, 2012 6:13 am

oops,that was the forums beer....

I wonder if Y.gloriosa(green form)should be in this discussion?

I have seen trunked specimens in St.Louis but no other trunking Yuccas.

igor.glukhovtsev · Post by **igor.glukhovtsev** » Sun Jul 29, 2012 8:59 am

hardyjim wrote:oops,that was the forums beer....

A kind of

plus the Canadian Royal Whiskey with Cola

andym · Post by **andym** » Sun Jul 29, 2012 12:49 pm

In the UK Yucca Gloriosa is quite hardy. Certainly in the December '10 freeze which killed virtually anything exotic Yucca Linearifolia stood out as hardy whereas other trunked yuccas suffered including Rostrata. I have planted three Linearifolia this year including the superb Galleano form. Its so different in the UK with milder wetter winters interdispersed with 1-2 freezes... perhaps not the best conditions for yuccas. I have other trunked Yuccas also but sadly not Elata

TimMAz6 · Post by **TimMAz6** » Sun Jul 29, 2012 8:11 pm

Welcome aboard!

Your really pushing the limits for the big trunkers. It will be nice to hear what survives in your area. I'm located in zone 6b Massachusetts. We get loads of cold and moisture (4inches=10cm) of precipitation every month of the year. Cold moisture is our biggest problem.

Yucca elata is the clear winner in my climate. Here's a seed grown Y. elata (the Yucca in the back). I just dug up a tall Y. gloriosa form.....in the grass.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... f48233.jpg>

This Yucca gloriosa form is a tall trunker too (Yucca in bloom......there is another gloriosa/recurvifolia type on the right). The blooming gloriosa was planted as a small offshoot back in 2003. There are so many forms of gloriosa/recurvifolia......if one type dies try another. Notice the Yucca in the front too......this is forming a trunk and it's a Yucca gloriosa x elata hybrid. Very cool.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 3ee00c.jpg>

This Yucca glauca v stricta is a nice trunker too and I'm sure is hardier than elata but the trunk diameter is less than elata. I'm not convinced these trunking strictas should be considered an equal to elata, rostrata, thompsoniana even though these strictas get tall.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 9ed979.jpg>

This form of Yucca gloriosa 'Tennessee treculeana form' is a stunner........leaves are very rigid and are like knives sticking out. It's getting massive now.........I should take another updated photo.......probably another 4" to 6" taller.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 938092.jpg>

Here's a narrow leaf Yucca gloriosa........really different when you see it in person. Leaf width is probably 60% of a 'normal' gloriosa. It's a great trunking form.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... AM0210.jpg>

You can see another form of Y. gloriosa in the rear of this photo......it's another form from Tennessee. It's over 6' tall now.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... M02152.jpg>

I picked up a new Yucca linearifolia and Yucca faxoniana (carnerosana) earlier this season. These will be interesting tests.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... AM0246.jpg>

Here's a photo showing my smaller Yucca rostrata.........this one doesn't get any protection the past few years and is still alive. The taller one I protect the crown against moisture.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 0188-1.jpg>

Here's an older photo of my taller Y. rostrata........it looks a little funny since it's recovering from its leaves being untied from winter protection.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 93a28f.jpg>

A shorter trunker is Y. elata v verdiensis. Seed grown from 2004 or so.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 505a49.jpg>

There are many other trunkers in the yard.....mostly Y. gloriosa/recurvifolia forms. I didn't find any recent photos. There is one from Tennessee which grows like it is on steriods and is just massive.

I'm messing more with hybrids now. Benny in Denmark created this beauty which is Y. filamentosa x rostrata.......it's new so I'm not sure if it will be a trunker. It performs very well in my climate.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 012fba.jpg>

MCKATELYN · Post by **MCKATELYN** » Sun Jul 29, 2012 11:59 pm

Tim,
Your yard is amazing. I knew you had a huge collection but didn't realize just how big it is. You have so many gloriosa. You mentioned they have all different degrees of hardiness. How would you rate the variegated (the one form I have lol) compared to most other (green) forms in hardiness? Is it about the same as the giant one from Tennessee?

TimMAz6 · Post by **TimMAz6** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 8:13 am

Yucca gloriosa 'variegata' is marginal in my climate. It does well most winters but it did die to the ground during the winter of 08-09. Here's it is in 2008. I would say variegata is one of the LEAST hardy gloriosa types......so if it's marginal in your climate the green forms will perform much better.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... t236-1.jpg>

Here it is after winter (total mush):
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 2510-2.jpg>

The other gloriosa/recurvifolia forms did fine that winter. I'm sure they had some white leaves from snow exposure but overall they did fine and the trunks did not die. I've killed a few types of gloriosa/recurvifolia but I don't grow them any longer. If you get one that dies, try another form. Also, like most plants they first year the tend to get the most damage........once established they will be hardier. Your best bet is to get a piece of root and let a new plant grow from it. Trying to transplant suckers or entire plants doesn't always work and they seem to be less hardy.

Yucca schottii died that winter:
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... l252-2.jpg>

Another smaller schottii died that winter:
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... il2532.jpg>

Monkey puzzle tree was toasted that winter:
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... il2552.jpg>

Here's a few photos from some other Yuccas that 08-09 winter.

Y. gloriosa 'aloifolia form' looked mint. I'm surprised it survived since it was young back then.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... ril259.jpg>

Y. gloriosa/recurvifolia form......nice weeping recurv type. Some white spots on the leaves......seems to be from prolong ice contact in my opinion not from cold. It's best to brush off snow as soon as possible and let let it remain on the leaves for days/weeks.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... il2538.jpg>

Y. gloriosa form from Tenn. Leaves are beat up from all the snow. But it did fine.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... il2525.jpg>

Y. elata did fine:
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... il2520.jpg>

Y. gloriosa 'Big Tenn form'. This is the monster form. It was a small sucker in 2003.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... il2514.jpg>

Y. rostrata.....but the leaf head was protected against moisture/snow.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 2579-1.jpg>

TimMAz6 · Post by **TimMAz6** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 8:22 am

PS, the Y. gloriosa 'Big Tennessee form' went from a small offshoot in 2004 to this monster in 2007.

Photo of offshoot in June 2004 when I moved to Massachusetts from Rhode Island (behind Sabal louisiana).
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 0002-4.jpg>

<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 320076.jpg>

<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 2007-1.jpg>

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:09 am

Pics of your yuccas never get old! I see so many yuccas I would love to have.

Thanks for all the good info.

Any pics of your newbies in the ground? I hope they do well for you.

TimMAz6 · Post by **TimMAz6** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:30 am

I need to take some good photos of the new Yuccas. I keep taking the easy way out by using my cell phone.......quality is aweful but it is easy.

another seed grown form of Y. filamentosa x rostrata (Benny hybrid)
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 3ca52a.jpg>

Yucca 'aloifolia x glauca v stricta' x arkansana......lots of genes in this one.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 5a7ee6.jpg>

The tall blooming Y. constricta x filamentosa has a few seed pods.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 56d2f7.jpg>

Loads of seed pods on this Y. constricta x filamentosa.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... 9a21ed.jpg>

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:06 am

Suburb Tim!

I wonder if you get a green Gloriosa recurvifolia pup if we
could do a trade or if I could buy one sometime.

Seems to be hard to find lately for some reason.

Nice tour.

TimMAz6 · Post by **TimMAz6** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:29 am

Hi Jim,

which form are you interested in? I just dug up that one Y. gloriosa form with a tall trunk to get a better view of my Y. elata. There are some roots behind my shed now. Your area is cold too......nice test to see which of these gloriosa/recurvs are the hardiest!

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 5:11 pm

What ever green form I can get my hands on,I was surprised to see them growing at the St.Louis zoo.

Another picture or 2-just for fun

andym · Post by **andym** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:45 pm

I was quite amazed that as a strap seedling my Yucca Aloifolia marginata/Variegata? came through the December'10 freeze -12C min and 9 days below freezing.It got me thinking that if the variegated form can survive that freeze so can the green form so I bought one of those too. but a much bigger specimen

BTW anyone know why i'm not getting a direct image on the thread

MCKATELYN · Post by **MCKATELYN** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 11:12 pm

Thanks for posting those winter pics Tim. That was very helpful. I have both the solid green weeping recurvafloria and variegated gloriosa. Every single winter the weeping recurvafloria come through looking horrible with tattered leaves like that in my climate and yet normally the variegated gloriosa pulls through untouched ( except for that one winter.lol) Im pretty sure I have those same two varieties as yours. I always thought the variegated gloriosa was much more cold hardy. I didn't even think that it could be the snow that is damaging the recurvafloria. From now on I'm going to start pulling its leaves up and tying them together for winter. Did you purchase the variegated gloriosa at plant delights? It's listed there as zone 7 but I would def give at least a zone 6 plant ( mine unprotected in zone 5). Where did you get that giant Tennessee form gloriosa?

igor.glukhovtsev · Post by **igor.glukhovtsev** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 3:45 am

Oh, boy! How beautiful your yucca "trees" are!
By the chance do you have seeds of your

TimMAz6 wrote:PS, the Y. gloriosa 'Big Tennessee form' went from a small offshoot in 2004 to this monster in 2007.

. This season the seeds of your 7 hybrid plants germinated successfully and do growing very good.

TimMAz6 · Post by **TimMAz6** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 2:21 pm

Nice find in St. Louis Jim!

Yucca aloifolia can't survive in our climate. It always dies. It seems to have difficulties when you have long periods below 10F (-12C). Y. aloifolia doesn't start to become reliable until you reach southern New Jersey on the east coast of the USA.

There are a few different forms of the recurvifolia type Yucca. Some appear to be 'identical' looking but some will die here in winter while others will survive. The recurvifolia types seem less hardy than the rigid gloriosa forms.......not sure why......I would have guessed the opposite. My Y. gloriosa variegata was from Fairweather Gardens in New Jersey.

I've never gotten seed to form on the Y. gloriosa 'Big Tennessee form'. It has bloomed in fall and in spring. This Yucca was sent to me by Rob of Tenn.

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 5:36 pm

TimMAz6 wrote:Yucca gloriosa 'variegata' is marginal in my climate. It does well most winters but it did die to the ground during the winter of 08-09. Here's it is in 2008. I would say variegata is one of the LEAST hardy gloriosa types......so if it's marginal in your climate the green forms will perform much better.
<img src=http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c309/ ... t236-1.jpg>

Here's a pic of my 10 year old Yucca gloriosa "variegata" monsters.

TimMAz6 · Post by **TimMAz6** » Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:24 pm

Hi Aaron,

is your Y. gloriosa variegata so small since it get killed to the ground EVERY year? Your yard looks very exposed....I'm sure that takes a toll too.

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 5:56 am

Still looking for green Gloriosa

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Wed Aug 01, 2012 11:45 am

TimMAz6 wrote:Hi Aaron,

is your Y. gloriosa variegata so small since it get killed to the ground EVERY year? Your yard looks very exposed....I'm sure that takes a toll too.

I think it only froze back once other than when it blooms. I think that year my big j-tree froze back it may have also? I think more than anything I don't water it any more. It is hard to get to now that it is within the "canyon".
The biggest problems I have had with them is when they get bigger they try and bloom here late in the fall, I have seen it bloom when the snow falls. When this happens I think it weakens them and then the bigger ones die over the winter. Next big one I get, I think I will remove the flower stalk early, or cover the plant.
This year I was going to try and water it well and grow it up again, but I forget about it.