Trachys adaptability/changes after near death experience

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 12:35 pm

Anybody else noticed big differences(afterwords) in Trachys that have survived 'near death experience'?

2 of the 3 trunk cut T.Fortunei(I need to check the other Fortxwag)have totally changed their appearance.

1.The leaves are smaller and stiffer-this could change as they increase their size.
2.The amount of tomentum on the petioles is unbelievable-
there was none before.
3.The trunk hairs seem to be more tightly wrapped,also may change as they age.

The increased tomentum I find most interesting,the smaller trunk/newer,tighter fibers are more
easily explainable.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 12:56 pm

That's exactly what I thought when I saw your survivors new leaves!
More compact, neater look than unaffected palms.
I think they're more attractive.

Just going on yours...none of mine survived.

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 1:30 pm

That really s**** Barb!

Here's a picture I "just"took of the 'new' tomentum.

Paul Ont · Post by **Paul Ont** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:48 pm

Think it's going into it's shock response :D ? The leaves getting tougher is probably an evolutionary defence mechanism to herbivory, which could be a problem in small palms... It's nicer, however, to think that this is a naturally evolved response to cold damage!

Thanks for sharing the photos!

canadianplant · Post by **canadianplant** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:59 pm

So mabey a stupid question, I think i missed something..... What you do mean by trunk cut. Im assuming you had to cut the palm down in soem way shape or form. I had no idea palms can surive after that.

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:05 pm

Jim,
good discussion.
I'll try to take some photos to share.
In brief: my 2009 15 gal. T. fortunei which barely survived the winter (trunk wrap, no heat; lows to 3 oF plus winds you wouldn't beleive if I told you) has very different leaves now. Trivial petioles, more compact leaves.
i'll try to take decent photos, plus some of the new T. fortunei for comparison with this time next year. Ditto for the two Waggies about to experience their first winter....

If you want to see a grim Trachy story, here is a cell phone snap shot I took last month of one of Bryan's (AG) beloved old "takil, really naini tal." The rest died despite trunk cutting.

--Erik

<table style="width:auto;"><tr><td><a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Yz ... site"><img src="http://lh6.ggpht.com/_r-MvN4jW1sE/TH11B ... AG0185.jpg" /></a></td></tr><tr><td style="font-family:arial,sans-serif; font-size:11px; text-align:right">From <a href="http://picasaweb.google.com/terdalfarm/ ... e">amazing ga</a></td></tr></table>

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:35 pm

Erik, your Trachy can handle the 3F no problem, but wind at that temp does the most damage.
Actually wind at most temps can severely damage Trachy.

Your--and my--trunk cutting bombed, and it's great that Jim's worked.
Hate to see palms in a death spiral.
But it must be his technique...somehow slightly different than ours.

I haven't yet dug out my dead trunk cut Naini Tal.
Hoping against hope that SOMETHING would pop up this summer.
Barb

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:25 am

Barb,
the trunk cutting wasn't be me: it was Bryan, at "Amazing Gardens." He only got down to 4 oF, and had a perfect microclimate: south side of his business, with lots of tall, mature bamboo for sun/wind protection. He lost several mature, established Trachycarpus. He is still really bummed about it. Seeing his made me appreciate all the more that mine did survive. --Erik

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Fri Sep 17, 2010 7:13 am

canadianplant wrote:So mabey a stupid question, I think i missed something..... What you do mean by trunk cut. Im assuming you had to cut the palm down in soem way shape or form. I had no idea palms can surive after that.

Barb

I think there may have been some root issues that finished yours off=
damn shame!
Looks like you have a nice replacement though,eeh?

O'Canada

Here's a link to the original post and the follow up

viewtopic.php?t=2686

Follow up

viewtopic.php?t=2763

There are pics of what they look like now somewhere in this post

viewtopic.php?t=2929

canadianplant · Post by **canadianplant** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 1:07 pm

Thanks jim..... Is it only cold hardy palms that do this?

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 1:39 pm

root issues that finished yours off

yup, probably, despite Freeze Pruf application.
Yes, the replacement is a beauty; easily gained a couple of years growth by getting the new one.

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 1:43 pm

Barb,
I'm losing track of your palms.
So, did you get a new, larger "naini tal" Trachy? --Erik
Jim--sorry to jump in with an off-topic question.

--Erik

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:11 pm

Glad I'm not the only one who forgets, Erik!

Nice trunk creep on the two palms (4 from John)

But...they're going into the cold building this winter.
I'm not going thru that again...

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:19 pm

Now I remember!
All I recalled was bananas and beer.

Yes, I like the protection plan for these guys. --Erik

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 3:13 pm

All I remember is the beer...
nice surprise the next morning...hey, new palms! (just kidding!)

Barb

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 3:28 pm

Jim,
sorry again for the thread jumping.
Barb,
the photo I posted above from AG was one of his "dead" naini tal Bryan thought was finished but which was just starting a tiny new spear. So, maybe there is a tiny chance for yours. Anyway, I tend to leave dead palms in place for a long time. (No, has never worked for me.) --Erik

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 3:38 pm

I hoped for that too, Erik and Jim.
I also left the dead Naini Tal in the ground.
It just gets more brown...not a green shoot emerging anywhere.

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Mon Sep 20, 2010 4:38 pm

canadianplant wrote:Thanks jim..... Is it only cold hardy palms that do this?

More likely to happen to cold hardy palms but I suppose
other palms could take the same treatment.