Cycas debaoensis ?

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 12:58 pm

Thrilled that waviness is showing at such a young stage.

Barb

Dean W. · Post by **Dean W.** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 1:34 pm

Congratulations, Barb, looking good.

What are you going to do with all of them?

Dean

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 2:35 pm

Dean, thanks.

Only 4 of 10 C.debaoensis seeds made it, and only 1 of 10 C. panzhihuaensis seeds.
There'll be some risk this winter/next spring from repotting, too.
As long as I end up with one of each, I'm happy.

Barb

Laaz · Post by **Laaz** » Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:17 pm

Great job Barb. Looks like they are coming along nicely !

virtualpalm · Post by **virtualpalm** » Thu Aug 28, 2008 3:43 pm

lucky1 wrote:Only 4 of 10 C.debaoensis seeds made it, and only 1 of 10 C. panzhihuaensis seeds.
There'll be some risk this winter/next spring from repotting, too.

Barb, that is too bad you didn't get more seedlings from your seeds. If I might make an observation... The soil in some of your photos of the seedlings in the cups looks awfully wet. Although these plants can take a good bit of water, the soil still needs to be quite well draining. Did some of the seeds germinate and damp off, or was it an issue of the seeds just not germinating at all (which could also be related to a high water holding capacity in the soil -- which tends to promote fungal growth).

As for repotting, as long as the soil is well draining, you really shouldn't have a problem with these two species. However, I actually don't think you would necessarily need to repot those seedlings this winter/spring. They could very easily grow in those same containers for another year. In general, it is best not to overpot cycads, particularly when the soil tends to hold too much water.

Jody

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:22 pm

Thanks, folks!

As always, I'm grateful for any advice that helps me grow these beauties.

Re damp soil...I watered plants just before I took the pics, 'coz I didn't want anyone saying they'd die in that powder-dry soil.

Water runs out almost immediately through a one-quarter inch diameter drilled hole.

Re germination percentage...it's my own fault, as I got really busy and hadn't noticed that the majority of C.panzhi seeds (and soil) were dry as a bone and all signs of impending germination ended when the "slit"--which initially showed something green coming--went brown. I was so mad at myself for neglecting them during hot dry windy days. I attempted to re-hydrate them, placing plastic over them after misting; none of the balance of 10 seeds of each C.debao... nor C.panzhi... "came back". One or two others got moldy, so I tossed them so others wouldn't be infected.

Chalked it up to 50% lack of experience and 50% lack of dedication when they required daily observation.

I actually don't think you would necessarily need to repot those seedlings this winter/spring. They could very easily grow in those same containers for another year

Great! I do wonder how long the root is in those 9-3/4" tall plastic containers. My young Dioon edule, for instance, had to go into a 1 gallon pot because the root was exactly that long already.

All my palm seeds failed, despite my full attention during the winter.
Should've bought the heat mat earlier.
So I'm thrilled these cycads are growing.

Thanks again for the valuable help.

Barb

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Fri Aug 29, 2008 7:31 pm

I'll pass, but in case others are interested:

Auction ends Sept.1st.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Cycas-debaoensis-UL ... 31240r1036

Barb

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Wed May 13, 2009 4:47 pm

The roots needed room!

Here's the pic of the plastic pots they were in.

And the second one:

The other two (of my four) were repotted previously, but haven't grown much more than these.
I'm anticipating a more substantial flush next time.
Looking forward to those lovely wavy leaves.

Barb

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:02 am

Looking good Barb!

I acquired a few seeds just in time for Christmas

Steve

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:37 am

Glad your errant seeds finally arrived.
I always love to see a cycad seed "smile".
How many did you get?

How long did it take from arrival to getting 'em to open?
I shouldn't even ask...you're the germinating King!

It'll be fun to see yours develop.
We can compare waviness of leaf segments.

You'll recall I'm VERY BUSY watching/waiting for my foxtail seeds to pop.

Barb

PS--find your tallest containers...long roots early on.
Holy cow...me giving YOU a suggestion!

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:36 pm

Barb,

It was the seedlings I ordered that were never shipped, now the seller has gone missing

but that's another story.........

This is the first I've tried these, thanks for posting your photos and advice, gives me a clear idea what to expect!
No problems at all with the seeds! Besides my impatient need to order them during the winter

(These arrived in the mailbox after a morning low of -4F/-20C)

Ordered 10 from Tom at the Cycad Jungle, they came well packed with an extra thrown in. One arrived already germinated, and about 80% of the rest well on their way

I found it interesting the cold didn't seem to bother them too much, Here's some photos from today. (The post above is from yesterday when received)

Steve

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:05 pm

Steve,
wonderful picture!

They were already germinating when you got them?

I got mine through RPS...took quite a while for them to pop if I recall.
But at least they did.

Glad you got order #2 from Tom Broome!

But I'd hound that unnamed seller #1 to return the money...you've lost two months waiting for his fraudulent sale.
And an email every day for the rest of his life wouldn't hurt!

Keep your camera nearby; they're spectacular as they come up ... but then again, aren't all Cycads?

Barb

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:27 pm

Barb, Thanks for the photo comment!
A radicle was just starting to emerge from one of the seeds, and the rest are not too far behind.
(it doesn't get much better than that

And seller #1................... lol
This was a private sale with a person in a gulf coast state, I really don't know what happened? He just sort of disappeared a few weeks after I paid him.
(It wasn't enough for him leave the country with, maybe enough gas to get to the next county

Steve

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:40 pm

he's probably still putting your seed order together...in the bar.

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 5:55 pm

Potted up 3 of them today!

Steve

oppalm · Post by **oppalm** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 6:12 pm

great pics and great detail in those pictures. good luck.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:06 pm

That "germinating to potting up" time has to beat even your previous best time!

Seeds so fresh they were still warm from the sun

Sure wish palm seeds were like that.

Yours will be caught up to my 1 year olds in...oh...about a week!
Can't wait to see them develop.

Barb

virtualpalm · Post by **virtualpalm** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:06 pm

This is a bit off the current topic of rapidly germinating seeds of Cycas debaoensis, but I thought it pertinent nonetheless. About a year and a half ago I received some seeds of a particularly plumose form of this species from a friend in Hawaii who had hand-picked both parents. Around 3/4 of them germinated and grew well initially... but the other 1/4 of the seeds lingered in the baggie but did not rot. Around a year later, about half of the seeds that were left sprouted and are now growing normally. I had not expected such a thing, but I have learned not to throw away cycad seeds unless they are for sure rotten or no good.

Good luck with your seedlings, Steve.

Jody

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:21 am

Thanks for the well wishes & comments

These seem like fast growers, at least for the few days I've had them.

Jody, That's a great point about Cycad seeds. Received a few Ceratozamia microstrobila seeds last March, within a few weeks they swelled and split open. After 2-3 months of no additional growth, I gave up on them thinking that I put them down too soon, too much heat, moisture, etc.
The container eventually ended up in the GH waiting to be cleaned out, noticed a frond emerging from the Perlite mid November. Have since cleaned the rest of the seeds up and back into the propagator

http://www.palmsnorth.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2193

Steve

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:12 pm

Two more radicles appeared today, that's 5 out of 11 so far

Steve

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Tue Dec 15, 2009 12:50 pm

Those are really cool!
They look like little space men sticking their tongues out at us-

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Tue Dec 15, 2009 2:37 pm

I think Barb said they also look like little hamburgers......

2 more sent out radicles today, That's 7 out of 11 so far

Steve

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Tue Dec 15, 2009 4:55 pm

hardyjim wrote:Those are really cool!
They look like little space men sticking their tongues out at us-

I know...they are so creepy. Very cool.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:00 pm

Yup, I'm always thinking of food...

Your batch will be 100% germination.

The cool thing about C.debaoensis is that while every seedling is similar, they exhibit different characteristics at different times from their siblings.

It'll be great to hear you report the leaf waviness starting.
They'll move very fast now.

Barb

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 3:49 pm

Barb, You were right, the last radicle emerged today!
100% germination in a week

I'll post some photos as they grow.

Steve

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 4:56 pm

You barely opened the package and they started germinating

That foretold the percentage.

Holy cow, they're really moving along DAILY, I can see the difference.

Look forward to seeing the first green thingy

Barb

oppalm · Post by **oppalm** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 7:35 pm

Steve those seeds look really great. great camera and great camera work. They are moving right aong.

Laaz · Post by **Laaz** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:09 pm

Great job Steve. Where did you get the seeds ?

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Thu Dec 17, 2009 11:12 pm

Kent, Thanks! Bought a new camera last May, I'm just figuring out how to properly use it

Todd, They came from Tom at the Cycad Jungle: http://cycadjungle.8m.com/
Seeds are not always listed on the website. When they are available, an inventory listing is sent by email.
(If interested, just contact them and ask to be put on the email list)

Steve

Laaz · Post by **Laaz** » Fri Dec 18, 2009 5:50 am

Thanks Steve. I'll have to check them out.

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Wed Dec 23, 2009 1:49 pm

A couple of photos to show growth rate,

Steve

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Wed Dec 23, 2009 4:28 pm

Reminds me of the rockband KIZZ.

Man.. those are the coolest seeds ever

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:07 pm

Some recent photos,

Steve

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:56 pm

Beautiful photography Steve.

Getting fresh seeds is unparalleled.
Palm seeds could take a lesson from how these C.debaoensis germinate.

Mine last year weren't as fresh as yours, but took about a month, I think.
They're so quick to develop and change, each change in a cycad is such a delightful process.

Palms...still yawning...er...a waiting.

Barb

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:21 pm

Thanks Barb, here we are 2.5 weeks from germination.

(1-13-10)

Steve

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:42 am

What's your soil mix for these?

I've never been able to find out if they prefer more acidic--versus, say, a 7.2--soil (which is my property's pH)
They do like light shade and high humidity, that's all I know.

Waiting for your first leaves...

Barb

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 10:46 am

Barb, Some of these are in a 50/50 orchid & container mix. The rest are in a container mix with 30% perlite added.
(Slim pickings for off the shelf stuff this time of year

I prefer to use a mix with lots of perlite, makes it a lot easier when re-potting. Have no idea about the ideal PH

In habitat, these tend to grow on & around limestone cliffs, but that may just be where the survivors ended up.

Thanks for the light/humidity observations!

Steve

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 11:11 am

I think I've got less perlite in my mix than you do, also caused by "shelf shortages" at repotting time.

I've heard references to limestone too, yet if in habitat they're under a canopy, there'd be a lot of leaves decaying on the floor, along with bird poop.
Steady moisture from high rainfall would presumably turn the soil towards the acidic scale, no matter what the underlying rock is.

A theory that may be way off base, LOL.

I don't want to risk one of my four C.debaoensis but am wondering if they'd prefer a slightly acidic fertilizer.
What do you think?

Barb
PS--we seem to be on page 6 of 5

But there's no page 6 when coming from the index, hmmm.
Jay, help!

Presto...page fixed! Thks boss!

virtualpalm · Post by **virtualpalm** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 3:17 pm

Barb, from my experience and from listening to others who are growing this species, Cy. debaoensis is highly adaptable when it comes to soil and fertilizer. You should not have to use any special products or techniques to get them to grow well.

Jody

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Sun Jan 17, 2010 5:29 pm

Now that you mention it, Jody, I now recall you advised me that previously.
But I figure it's easy to look after a plant if one provides exactly what it's happiest growing in.

I've got such a buggaboo it seems about soil pH, knowing mine at 7.2 is almost too alkaline for a lot of plants that I like.
So I've learned to use sulphur, or judiciously-applied epsom salts, or whatever to correct it for the plants I want.

It occurred to me that palms might have preferences too, yet the myriad of great educational sites barely touch on the subject, with the exception of LY suspected to be because of Florida's alkaline sandy soils.

Thanks!

Hopefully the horrible week-long freeze in Florida left your gorgeous plants relatively unscathed.
We were sure thinking about you folks!

Barb

PalmsNorth.com

Cycas debaoensis ?

C.debaoensis waviness beginning to show

C.debaoensis on eBay $23.00

Repotted 2 remaining C.debaoensis