Trachycarpus Tesan

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Sat Feb 07, 2009 1:22 pm

I know someone who has some Tesan plants with their first fan leaves for sale,these are very unique palms and to my knowledge not available anywhere except in seed form, they are priced right,let me know if your interested and I will pass along the contact info and a link so you can see what they look like.

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Thu Feb 12, 2009 12:51 pm

Really,no interest in these palms?Well here are some pics of the T.tesan I got in the mail today $10 a piece $5 for the Korean T.wagnerianus-Also Garry told me in a e-mail that the mountain T.tesan have seen -2F this winter,anyway here are some pics,the seedlings are the K-T.wags,I also put some of my T.fortunei seedlings pics in there for comparison,note how much more stout and compact the Tesan are compared to T.fort
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09009.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09009.jpg" border="0" alt="T.tesan"></a>
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09003.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09003.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09002.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09002.jpg" border="0" alt="T.tesan 2-12-09"></a>

Heres a closeup of tesan "trunk" and then my T.fort "trunk"
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09006.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09006.jpg" border="0" alt="T.tesan("trunk")"></a>
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09007.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09007.jpg" border="0" alt="T.fort(comparison)"></a>

And the Korean T.wags
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09008.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -09008.jpg" border="0" alt="kOREAN- T.wagnerianus"></a>

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 11:27 am

Are you selling them? My tesan died, but would like try another. Also are the Korean wagies hardier?

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 12:00 pm

I am not seeling them but I know of someone who is,they are very cool plants and I can't wait to see what they are like when they grow up.
I ordered 6 so I can test them in a variety of situations,like trying some in the ground this coming winter but also waiting until some are bigger.
As far as the T.wags go,what I have been able to piece together is that they were possibly growing wild in Korea and that they may be hardier,this is kind of news to me as I thought there were not any growing wild but it seems info about these Trachys change weekly.I am not sure where the seeds came from,the guy I bought them from said they are rare,I am waiting to hear back from himI tend to be trusting of people for the most part until they prove otherwise.
If you want his contact info you can e-mail me at jimpdelaney@yahoo.com
They are sweet plants,Jeff posted a thread about these(I believe last March)on GWF under the title Trachycarpus fortunei"tesan"

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Sat Feb 14, 2009 10:47 pm

Thanks for the good info.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 1:40 pm

Nice haul, Jim.

Now when are John or Barrie gonna start stocking this neat stuff...for resale into Canada?

Aaron, it died???? was your tesan protected during winter?
I know you generally don't protect your yuccas.

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:02 pm

Thanks Barb,I really love these palms! and for whatever reason a lot of people have checked them out but not bought any which is fine with me cuz I want to buy somemore!These seeds are from Trachys that naturally grow in a very cold area,Garry is sending me some seeds from a mountain Tesan and one of is custumers described them as the size of blueberries!I will post a pic if thats the case.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:46 pm

Jim,
Many of us will follow tesan's progress with interest.

Barb

oppalm · Post by **oppalm** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 5:47 am

The T Tesan do look like they have a stockier full figured trunk. I have enough palms in my collection right now. It is tempting though. Good luck Jim.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:03 am

I noticed the stockier trunk too.
Resembles my "nainital"

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 10:40 am

Thanks Oppalm,hows your leaf pile experiment going?I just realized that I have a foot long temp probe that I can poke in the Needle palm leaf piles but so far it has not been cold enough to try out,I wish I would have thought of this when it was -17F,it would have been interesting to see what the difference was.
I am in the same boat with having enough palms but I look at these as an investment and the price is right.
Barb,thats a nice sized Naini Tal I would be interested in a pic of the crown from the top,kristof on EPS is supposed to post a pic of his good sized Naini Tal next to a pic of a 2-3' Tesan the Garry posted,I think the leaves look quite similar at a young age,it will be interesting to compare-

DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:23 am

lucky1 wrote: Aaron, it died???? was your tesan protected during winter?
I know you generally don't protect your yuccas.

Barb

Hi Barb,
It was very small and never was planted. It took a lot of cold in it's pot, but was not what killed it. I think I let it go to long without a drink of water last summer.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:41 am

Jim, I'll take another pic if this is too vague

Aaron,

Hey, I've done that too!
Good reason to get another one

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 1:34 pm

Nice palm Barb!-how about a shot from higher up to see the leaf structure and crown

Okanagan desert-palms · Post by **Okanagan desert-palms** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:53 pm

Barb I have about ten T.tesan that I got from Maccario as seedlings in 2006. They are going to be a few years yet before they can be put to any type of winter test. I also have about ten Kentucky Trachy very cold hardy said to be frozen solid in their 1 gal. pots for days. As well 14 T. nainital now 3 gal size might try one or two at this size planted this spring. I think I`ll wait and see how T. tesan performs as an adult before I make any more investment in buying anymore for myself or resale. They sound promising we`ll see.

John

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:47 pm

ODP,are those(frozen) trachys from brians botanicals on e-bay?
Do you have any pics?

Heres a pic of one of my wagxfort as I understand it,or as they call it Hayes stiffie- last Oct-
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -08020.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -08020.jpg" border="0" alt="Wagxfort"></a>

Okanagan desert-palms · Post by **Okanagan desert-palms** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 7:41 am

Jim I will take some pics of the "Brian`s botanicals" Trachy`s that I have from Kentucky.

John

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 11:28 am

John, I'll wait to see your tesan winter results as they age.
But it's good to know you have some.

Here are some more nainital pics (a bit dark, sorry).
Leaves are somewhat folded from dry soil (not cold...it's in the cold building at 8C 46F).
Dry soil makes both my fortunei and nainital fold leaves.

Nainital leaf underside:

Trachy fortunei leaf underside (oops, I think I see a bug!)

Barb

Okanagan desert-palms · Post by **Okanagan desert-palms** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 12:02 pm

Barb dryness is a concern as is lack of light. Nice to see yours are in a sunny location. Yours look great.

John

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 12:27 pm

I use folding leaves as a message from the palms that they want water.

My 32yr old Trachy's leaves unfold only hours after a good watering.
No apparent harm done.

But maybe that's why it's only 6 feet tall

John, I'm amazed at the 2 Washy filifera I got from you. Do they ever quit growing?

Can't find recent pics of them, sorry.

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 1:22 pm

Barb,although I guess its more reasonable to think that your palm is Naini Tal,it sure looks more like a Takil! the only thing is in the Takil pics I have seen,the leaves appear more grayish colored.How old is that palm? Nice pics,do you have any from when it was smaller?

themes · Post by **themes** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 3:40 pm

Okanagan desert-palms wrote:Barb dryness is a concern as is lack of light. Nice to see yours are in a sunny location. Yours look great.

John

I have many trachys growing in deep shade. I think they do better in shade personally. Some receive only 30 mins of direct sunlight....

Okanagan desert-palms · Post by **Okanagan desert-palms** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 4:31 pm

Themes in regards to low light or no light is not outside I`m refering to but overwintered inside. My trachy`s grow greener in part shade as well outside. Yours look healthy. Where are you located? Barb those W. filifera will really take off after you transplant if you haven`t already?

John

themes · Post by **themes** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 5:04 pm

Okanagan desert-palms wrote:Themes in regards to low light or no light is not outside I`m refering to but overwintered inside. My trachy`s grow greener in part shade as well outside. Yours look healthy. Where are you located? Barb those W. filifera will really take off after you transplant if you haven`t already?

John

Sorry, I thought you meant outside. Funnily enough the ones in shade are greener and look healthier. The ones in full sun can get a bit yellow. Located in the Uk...been outside all winter unprotected apart from a tree canopy.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 5:56 pm

Hi mo, nice to see you back.
I agree entirely. Most of my palms are in only morning sun during summer in our hot dry area.
The big potted Trachy spent only a few days in hot sun and wind. Leaves were broken in half from the wind, and its colour looked chlorotic. All my palms, triangles, spindles, trachies, and small sabals etc spend summer protected from hot sun.

The only palms that love the intense heat here are the big CIDP and the 2 Washy filifera.

Do you have any pictures of your palm(s) during the snow event in the UK?

And John, yes, finally we have sunshine again (after what seemed like a month of valley fog).
The big windows let in lots of sun, and the palms are responding nicely.
I haven't transplanted the Washies yet...will wait until warm weather and they can go outside.
Will look forward to seeing your pics.

Jim, I got the nainital from Barrie last year (or was it the year before?), so there are no other pics of it.
It just looks bulletproof to me.

Barb

themes · Post by **themes** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 7:03 pm

Thanks for the welcome. Unfortunately not. I did take some pics of the snow but they seem to have been overwritten on my sd card. Although we had all this snow it did nothing to the palms. I have over 20 trachys planted outside and not one showed any signs of damage. The nights proceeding the snow..we had some coldest temps here for 10 years..so far nothings croaked apart from a Parajubaea TVT.(hoping it reshoots in the spring). I have tree canopy so it was forced on me..however I discovered how much the trachys like shade..and deep shade at that. I have two trachys in full sun and they do look a bit chlorotic as you said..I will see if epsoms salts will help to green them up..if not I will move later in the year.

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 7:25 pm

That alpine kink is a curious growth habit,I have only seen it that pronounced in Takil and Manipur but have seen pics of many other Trachys with this trait,I have read that it has to do with the placement of the embryo in the seed

my Manipur is the only Trachy of mine with as pronounced a kink as yours but the Tesan look like they will exibit this as well
Themes/Barb,thats interesting that you say Trachys do so well in shade,I am wondering what size these palms are and if they have deep root sytems.I do know that Latisectus,martianus and manipur have all done well inside(south window)and I think morning sun or speckled sunlight would be good when they go outside as is recommended for smaller palms of these varieties.All things being equal(which they are not)it will be interesting to see which one of my waggies does the best this year,one is under a tree and gets less than a half day,one is out another 20ft away and gets a few more hours and one is out even more and gets much more sun so,we shall see.

themes · Post by **themes** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 8:39 pm

hardyjim wrote: Themes/Barb,thats interesting that you say Trachys do so well in shade,I am wondering what size these palms are and if they have deep root sytems.I do know that Latisectus,martianus and manipur have all done well inside(south window)and I think morning sun or speckled sunlight would be good when they go outside as is recommended for smaller palms of these varieties.All things being equal(which they are not)it will be interesting to see which one of my waggies does the best this year,one is under a tree and gets less than a half day,one is out another 20ft away and gets a few more hours and one is out even more and gets much more sun so,we shall see.

all about this size..

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Wed Feb 18, 2009 9:38 pm

mo, what a fabulous tropical setting!
Your plants are obviously used to the low light in summer, but the real benefit is the consistent humidity within the planted community. And in winter, with deciduous trees having shed their leaves, your palms receive more bright light, and they've obviously become accustomed.

Sun in winter is so welcome to those of us in northern latitudes.

Thanks for those pictures!
We hope your parajubea comes back.
Epsom salts are a quick tonic producing green-up, mine looked great afterward.
I'd leave a Waggie in full sun before I'd plant a Trachy in that spot.

Jim, oh oh, now I've got a kinky palm

Among similar-looking plants, I always look at the leaf underside and note differences where it attaches to the stem.
Doubt it's too reliable though, because plants' physical characteristics may change a bit as they mature.

Re the slow acclimatization of palms back into morning sun once they go outdoors, I'm still having trouble with that. Even brief morning sun burned the ends of my 3 Dypsis decaryi last summer. I may have to find a total shade spot for a couple of weeks, but then they'd NEVER get used to sun

I forget who it was here on Palms North but they said many palms that are intended for sale to big box stores or wholesale nurseries are grown in crowded situations in light to full shade, which tends to produce taller specimens.
An example was the Windmill Palm. Mine was tall when I bought it, but after several months the tall stems started to spread out (similar to a bush collapsing), so I was advised to put it in mostly shade. In short order the stems again stood up.

Barb

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 5:40 am

Its nice that they get a long season of sunlight when the leaves are off the trees,I wonder what the growth rate is summer vs winter(sun vs shade) and what are your avg highs and lows summer vs winter? Nice garden,love the tree fern,is it D.antarctica?

themes · Post by **themes** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:57 pm

hardyjim wrote:Its nice that they get a long season of sunlight when the leaves are off the trees,I wonder what the growth rate is summer vs winter(sun vs shade) and what are your avg highs and lows summer vs winter? Nice garden,love the tree fern,is it D.antarctica?

Yes its a DA I have been impressed last year so I got more this year. Summer was rainy hardly seen the sun at all. its zone 8 trying to get it to a nine by trees and hedges protection. This winter has been the coldest in 10 years and I am in very good heart as trachys have been growing in winter. I estimate the growth in winter period better then summer when the leaves fell which is a contridiction in terms. The trachy Wagnerianus look immaculate and they are highly recommended. Got a small trach fortunei x wagnerianus that I want to plant in spring so am very excited...Going to be really adventurous and try Robusta, Livistonia Decora, Trithrinax Acanthocoma and Campestris. I can't wait for spring! Lowest this year was -6 so I am very lucky compared to a lot of you..

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 1:04 pm

Mo,
Your spring must nearly be at the door...we used to plant (carefully) end-February when I lived in Vancouver (on the Coast). Remember to take pictures when you do start planting.
Have you yet to purchase the plants, or are they in your greenhouse or indoors?

Adventurous indeed!

Barb

themes · Post by **themes** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 2:46 pm

lucky1 wrote:Mo,
Your spring must nearly be at the door...we used to plant (carefully) end-February when I lived in Vancouver (on the Coast). Remember to take pictures when you do start planting.
Have you yet to purchase the plants, or are they in your greenhouse or indoors?

Adventurous indeed!
Barb

yes alot

6 butia capitata
2 chamaedorea radicalis
2Trachycapus Wagnerianus
2 washington robusta
2 livistonia decora
2 trithrinax acanthocoma
1 trithrinax campestris
2 cordyline dazzler
1 cordyline variegata
2 yucca gloriosa
2 yucca gloriosa variegata
Loads of phormiums

and the list goes on...all outside in pots

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:00 pm

Mo,
I went back and looked at your pics.
In your first picture, there's a cordyline at right bottom.
"Dazzler"? or "Variegata"?

Impressive list for an impressive landscape.

Which has proven difficult for your conditions?
Barb

themes · Post by **themes** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 6:13 pm

lucky1 wrote:Mo,
I went back and looked at your pics.
In your first picture, there's a cordyline at right bottom.
"Dazzler"? or "Variegata"?

Impressive list for an impressive landscape.

Which has proven difficult for your conditions?
Barb

Cordyline Australis. So far so good..Nothing has died except the Parajubaea (hope it has not died). Cordylines can be a bit tricky to establish while young..Indivisia has been known to croak in the Uk unexpectantly (want to try this one..in spring). Cordyline Purperea when small can be tricky. Believe it or Not I have more trouble with Phormiums then any other plant because of the Shade..either struggle or lose variegation. The two Chamaerops Cerifera are hard to grow for me because of the same reason. Both have lost some zing to them..

Cordylines are extremely common in the UK and can be brought very cheaply..they also grow incredibly quickly. Australis is the best one for hardiness and ease.

Want to try Nannorrhops Ritchiana. This palm has died for many in the UK. It hates winter wet which we get alot of. If its dry like some parts of the US a zone 6 might get one to survive while here a zone 9 could die. It needs summer temps to augment its hardiness. If you can get hold of one try it. if you have low rainfall or good drainage.

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Thu Feb 19, 2009 9:36 pm

Themes I think some of those palm will need more sun like robusta,is that the plan?oh,and Mazari too.
Love the tree ferns!so prehistoric looking-
I think Mazari would be a good one for Barb too,but like you mentioned they need it dry and I kind of question their cold hardiness,mine is crispy from probably no lower than middle to low teens,pretty sure its still alive so we will see how it recovers,a hot summer or at least early hot weather in spring would help,looks unlikely but you never know

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 8:02 am

Mo, this might be difficult to achieve without doing damage, but could you remove one or two overstory branches (especially the ones that create such deep shade that impact Chamaerops cerifera?
My little potted one loves intense sun.

But ultimately, drainage will be the biggest issue for long-term success, I think.

The Okanagan area of BC is generally in a rain-deficit.
My area gets only 13 inches of precip annually, and 80 per cent is in the form of snow.

We're rated as semi-arid...but I doubt the semi part.

I've got a small unnamed cordyline.
Will get a pic and maybe you can ID it.
I'm hoping it's an australis.

Mo, I hope your neighbours appreciate the tropical paradise you've created!

Jim, I couldn't get a mazari, so opted instead for two gorgeous little Brahea armata.
They're doing quite well.

Barb

themes · Post by **themes** » Fri Feb 20, 2009 2:53 pm

lucky1 wrote:Mo, this might be difficult to achieve without doing damage, but could you remove one or two overstory branches (especially the ones that create such deep shade that impact Chamaerops cerifera?
My little potted one loves intense sun.

But ultimately, drainage will be the biggest issue for long-term success, I think.

The Okanagan area of BC is generally in a rain-deficit.
My area gets only 13 inches of precip annually, and 80 per cent is in the form of snow.
We're rated as semi-arid...but I doubt the semi part.

I've got a small unnamed cordyline.
Will get a pic and maybe you can ID it.
I'm hoping it's an australis.

Mo, I hope your neighbours appreciate the tropical paradise you've created!

Jim, I couldn't get a mazari, so opted instead for two gorgeous little Brahea armata.
They're doing quite well.

Barb

I love the tree and love the shade it creates. Will see how things develop may move the chamaerops..

I have very few places which get sun..The spaces are for the Robustas. Be glad to Id the cordyline..if i know it , that is

As for Brahea Armata..(It has exceeded my expectations) I have a small one left unprotected in the front garden..It looks great. Even its colour is there unlike the Cerifera. Definately going to get some more

hatfam · Post by **hatfam** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 10:33 am

hardyjim wrote:I know someone who has some Tesan plants with their first fan leaves for sale,these are very unique palms and to my knowledge not available anywhere except in seed form, they are priced right,let me know if your interested and I will pass along the contact info and a link so you can see what they look like.

Just got in 3 Tesans and 3 of the waggies. They look great. Now all I need is that magic elixir to make grow 3'-4' in a month or two

hardyjim · Post by **hardyjim** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 10:20 pm

Thats great,it will be interesting to see how they do this summer and see what these T.wags look like when they get bigger,Jeff said these are a pure strain,are the most beautiful he's seen and may be more cold hardy then your avg waggies,time will tell. I think the tesan are really cool looking palms when they get bigger and even if they are"just"as cold hardy as (reg)fortunei it will be fun to see how they turn out,the wags as well.
Garry sent me more seeds,the mountain tesan seeds are freeking HUGE!,like 2-3 time princeps size-I apoligize for the pic quality,they are clockwise from top/left to bottom/left-Princeps/Misan
Mt.tesan/P.green(nova)
<a href="http://s297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -27-09.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm22 ... -27-09.jpg" border="0" alt="Trachy seeds"></a>

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