Butia capitata cold damage

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:57 pm

Just uncovered my Butia and all the leaves are brown and dry, but i cant pull out the spear leaf . So i hope it will grown again soon. He suffered temp. of -9c before i put on the protection. Almost all leaves turn brown 1 week later the hard freeze. And inside my protection the temp. never go down under -5c during this winter, and the soil inside protection never freeze hard. So i think the problem is due to the hard freeze he encountered before. Another thing is, he started to lost the lower leaves in late september, and i still don t know why ?

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:02 pm

temp. of -9c before i put on the protection.

When was it planted?

I lost a perfectly beautiful and up-to-then thriving B.capitata IN THE HOUSE late winter last year.
It simply collapsed, much like what your second pic shows.

A poster (damir) recently posted that Butias do not like Copper fungicide, which is what most people use to prevent bud rot/death.

Barb

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:35 pm

Hi, i planted it last june, and yes i treated it with i little bit fongicide in powder before puting protection on. Ill tell you if the cause later on, i have another Butia to uncover later on this week or next week at one of my customer. But is Butia was in really good shape when i covered it, better than mine.He only saw -3c before protection and mine -9c. I really think my problem was the hard freeze, and maybe some decease before, cause , like i said before, he started to lose fronds in late september.

Ben

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:57 pm

FYI, just uncover my Washingtonia filifera baby (1 feet tall). Almost no protection. Only rose cone on them, some with straws other without. No heat but same result, all died. I tried one with rose cone and 9 feer heat cable, and all fronds died but cannot pull out spear leaf. Some green tissue on it. Almost no snow cover on these cone and minus temp. of -23c this winter. So i let you know if he restard to grow, i hope so...
The last pic is the one with heat cable...

Ben

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DesertZone · Post by **DesertZone** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:33 pm

Sorry too hear about the palms, I hope that awesome butia pulls through.

lucky1 · Post by **lucky1** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:58 pm

Beny, that's so sad losing the Washy filiferas.
Even with a heat cable and insulated cover the second one died?
Maybe it was too young to plant out.

I ended up overdoing my Washy filifera first year in the ground protection.
But it was the first winter in the ground so better safe than sorry.
C-9 Christmas lights coiled on the rocks around its base (but not touching the trunk), then plastic, then 4-inch batt insulation, then foam (floor underlay), then plastic again.
The thermometer often read 29C if the sun shone through the little plastic window facing south.
Way too warm.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6968189291/" title="002 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7045/6968 ... 39db_z.jpg" width="480" height="640" alt="002"></a>

Hope the other Butia that you're uncovering is fine.
Post a pic when you uncover please.

Barb

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:36 pm

Ok Barb, maybe i will uncover it this weekend. And dont worry about my young washy, i still have a few other. I grown them from seeds 3 years ago. I m not surprised about the results. I will have a 30 gallons Washy this spring from Mike, but that one will have the same protection than the Trachy. Temp, never go down under -4c even at -23c outside.
I think the Washy with heat cable is not dead, i see a little bit green tissue on spear leave. Will see in few weeks....

Ben

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:54 pm

Ben,
I've had a jelly palm (my avatar) be completely defoliated a few times. It came back with summer heat, water and fertilizer. Keep us updated. --Erik

coconutmike · Post by **coconutmike** » Tue Mar 13, 2012 8:09 pm

Some good progress Beny. Washy's don't like heat cables, I fried an 8 footer last year with cables. I got 2 9-10 footers out there I will post soon. I wrapped them after we had -8c but they should be fine. I am concerned about the washy in the front the box has had and opening since the first snow storm. My trachy's are good unwrapped a couple. Your Pindo was dead or going to die even before the winter. You did everything correctly so it was just bad luck. I believe it got over-watered and had a fungal problem. I will open my 11-12 foot pindo late this week early next week. Try pindo again in your yard it works for us here and looks exotic. Thanks for posting.
Coconutmike

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:06 pm

Thanks Mike...the washy had the heat cable on the ground at the base. The leaves are not dry, but look mushy and dark, cant pull the spear. So i hope it will restard, same for my Butia. I will uncover my Butia at my customer in south shore this saturday and will see. His Butia was really in good shape before cover it. Same for the sabal palmetto. Will give you news next weeks...
Beny

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:09 pm

Ok , thx Erik...will see in the next few weeks..ill give you news...

Beny

coconutmike · Post by **coconutmike** » Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:28 pm

I will look for that I will also post more on youtube in a couple of days

mike

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:07 pm

Hi guys, just uncover my last customer's palms, great succes except for one Trachycarpus that had fongus problem, i puted some fongicide around the crown but not on the leaves, and the leaves had that problem. The center leaves and spear still green and alive. I had really good result for all the other Trachy and YES the Butia my customer had at the front of his house survived with no problem at all, no burn leaves, im really happy after the problem i had with MY Butia. Like Mike said, maybe he was sick before, ill wait if it restard or not.
For the first time i tried to protect a Sabal palmetto, and it was a relatively succes. It has some brown leaves but the center still green. I think my problem was, i did not cover all the crown with the arbotex. So they suffer from the heat at the top of the box, the arbotex did not absorb the humidity from the leaves sweat.

Ill posted more clip in the next days on my youtube channel Expressiontropicale...

Ben

coconutmike · Post by **coconutmike** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:40 pm

Good-job overall Beny - Your results are what I expected or slightly better. Similsr to mine!
Excellent job. I have a few techniques we will work on for the bigger palms next year. Customers are expecting zero damage so we will work on that locally
Cheers
mike

Okanagan desert-palms · Sat Mar 17, 2012 8:14 pm

Beny and Mike you guys are miles ahead of us here in south central B.C. Just from seeing what you guys can accomplish in Montreal. I am planting two 15 gal. B.capitata and two B.eriospatha. Those palms look great! Beny how cold did the Sabal palmetto get with the protection?

John

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:56 pm

Hi John, i did not monitorized the temp. inside the cage at my customer location, but i can tell you that at my home with the same protection, my Butia (who s lost all leaves after seeing a -9c last november) did not see temp. below -5c. when it was -23c outside. But i think the burn leaves that my Sabal palmetto had is du to the arbotex, i did nt cover the top off the leaves.
Almost all my palms had arbotex covering all the leaves, like that, the humidity du to the transpiration when it get to hot inside(more than +15c) is absorbed by the arbotex. So that help leaves. With that technique, i almost not have burn tip. I tried some without arbotex, and i had good result too. The arbotex is just a help in case it get to warm inside.
One thing is to do not forget to put some heat at the base of the palm in the box. For better result, we need to have almost the same temp. at the base and at the top of the palm. I tried to put only light at the middle of the trunk and my soil still frozen. Even if the temp. at the middle of the box indicated +8c. The bottom was at-1c. Big difference.
So i putted 1 12 foot heat cable at the base and 1x23watts fluocompact light at the middle of the trunk, and the temp. was almost the same everywhere in the box (1-2c difference, not more). Thats for a box of 8 feets tall, 2 feets wide, 2 inch styrofoam thats it.....temp. never go down under -4c even at -20c outside.

Hope that will help you guys....

Ben

Beny · Post by **Beny** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 6:08 pm

Ok, Mike, no problem with that...we will put palm trees everywhere in southern Quebec. What do you think about a Ste-Catherine or a Blv.Labelle with 2 rank of palm trees just like in Santa-Monica.

HA

Ben

PalmsNorth.com

Butia capitata cold damage

Butia capitata cold damage

Washingtonia basic winter protection result..

Some good progress Beny

Beny

Palm survived another winter in zone 5a

Beny