Hello from Oklahoma

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Tue Oct 13, 2009 7:31 pm

Hello from Oklahoma!
I was referred here by knnn, whom I "met" by commenting on his neat YouTube video showing how to build a minigreenhouse ([url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zfIHf2PNVA[/url]).
I'm working on a tropical-themed garden around the pool on our hobby farm outside Tulsa. Here are some photos of the yard, only a few palm-related: [url]http://picasaweb.google.com/terdalfarm/ ... directlink[/url].
I've had a small Butia in the ground through the past two winters. I bought it from Cistus Nursery ([url]http://www.cistus.com/[/url]) in Portland, Oregon. Their motto is, "the home for zonal denial." I also bought a Jubaea, a Chamaedora radicalis, a T. wagnerius, and a Brahea. Those are still in pots and come in every winter.
I've also overwinted for two winters a Chamearops I bought at Home Depot. Also from Home Depot were two Washingtonia I lost last Spring from rot. The W. filifera had made it through the previous winter so I planted out one W. robusta; the other W. robusta is in a large pot and is doing great after spending another winter indoors. Needless to say, the wife is not keen on my letting any palm overwinter outside. (Did I mention she is from Michigan? I am originally from Oregon, where Trachycarpus are street trees.)
Despite her misgivings, I planted a 15 gallon T. fortunei and a 15 gallon Butia last spring which were surprise finds at the local Home Depot. I insist on trying to overwinter them in the ground and so am here looking for ideas.
We are on the zone 6/7 margin here. It gets down into the low single digits (Farenheit) at least once each year. The lowest I have recorded was 0 oF. Most of the winter is fairly mild, however. Spring is tough as we swing from temps in the 80s to the 20s pretty fast, with lots of rain.
The microclimate I've selected for my project is...poor. On a hill top, west side of the house, with tree-less pasture for wind protection (i.e., none).

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:07 am

Welcome to PalmsNorth, Lots of good info & people here!

Steve

BILL MA · Post by **BILL MA** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:14 am

Welcome aboard! We'll get your wife hooked on planting palms outside in no time

Bill

Paul Ont · Post by **Paul Ont** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:48 am

Welcome aboard!

I'm sure you've seen this, but, just in case, I thought I'd post the link:

http://www.amazinggardens.com/
http://www.amazinggardens.com/john.html
http://www.alligatoralley.com/plantlocal.html

No, I'm in not affiliated with this company, just a satisfied customer!

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:52 am

Bill,
She likes to build things, so I think we're going to make a frame using 2" x 4"s to go over the [i]Butia[/i]. We'd staple clear plastic to the frame. She also wants to use heat tape to preserve the trunk and spear. Should the tape directly contact the plant tissue, or do we wrap the plant first with fabric of some sort and then wrap the heat tape?

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:58 am

Paul,
thanks for the links. I've been to those websites but not the actual store. I keep assuming I'll be in OKC on business sometime and will be able to drop by but it hasn't happened yet. I prefer large specimens, so it makes sense to drive there vs, mail order.
I'll be driving to Ft. Worth, Texas, over the weekend. Does anyone know of a good nursery there that sells palms? I'd have room for a 5 gallon something (Sabal?) that I could keep inside until May.

rgrin1 · Post by **rgrin1** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:08 pm

Hello and welcome,
I am new myself here and just learning my way around. I am little south of you in North Texas. I have found that eventually we will have a winter here that will kill the robusta while the filifera seems to go unphased. I tried a Jubaea here and the winters didn't phase it but it just could not handle the heat of summer. I may try another one some day. I have plenty of Butia Pindo Palm seeds if you want any. I want to try a wooly Butia.

Rocky

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 7:51 pm

My Jubaea has been a disappointment. I keep it in a pot and change soils annually. It is outside May - October. It lives outdoors in partial shade to avoid the worst heat. (The potted Chameadora radicalis next to it does great.) The Jubaea long ago lost all of its foliage, and has not grown new leaves in two years--but the leaf spear is alive and grows a couple of centimeters a year. I am regularly tempted to send it to the compost pile, but with that intact spear I don't. Basil popped up in the pot and is doing well so I figure the pot earns its keep by making pesto ingredients while tolerating the Jubea. So much for my scheme to grow my own palm wine.
Being from North Texas, let me ask: is it easy to find palms for sale in nurseries around there? If so, I'll bring one home this weekend (I'll be in Ft. Worth).

rgrin1 · Post by **rgrin1** » Wed Oct 14, 2009 8:03 pm

Yes it is easy to find palms around here, Often this time of year stores like Lowes & Hoe Depot wants to get rid of their remaining palms and cut the price a lot. There is a huge palm store down in Dallas across from the Farmers Market. I am located close to Ft Worth if you are interested in a couple of Pindo seedlings.

If you want directions to the palm store in Dallas let me know. They are often a bit pricey there and many of their palms require a crane to plant because they are so big, but they do have some smaller ones as well.

This link has some interesting photos of palms in the area: http://dallaspalms.com/

BILL MA · Post by **BILL MA** » Thu Oct 15, 2009 5:11 pm

Hey terdalfarm whats your Name? Helps in the posts. Anyways I'm glad your wife is into the palms too. I use c7 or c9 christmas lights to heat stuff, they pump off some serious heat if your encloser is tight plus they are super cheap! I would say use them and string them around the trunk, heat rises so it will heat the leaves too. You'll only need to turn them on when the temperature is threatening I find that one string of c9 can raise ambient 30+ degrees, plenty for your area. I just built six 2*4 boxes for my palms to get ready for the winter. You still have plenty of time but being ready ahead of time is always nice. Good luck with your building.

Rocky, I'm curios about hardy live oaks? I know they have some mature species in Tulsa and I was wondering what kind of hybrids they offer in your area? Do you have any knowledge on this?

Bill

rgrin1 · Post by **rgrin1** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 4:06 pm

Bill,

I don't know much about these. However I had just planted one about a month ago to try to hide the view to my lazy neighbor's back yard. I still have the information tag that came with the tree. Here is what it says: Live Oak - Roble Vivo Grown by: TRI-B Hulbert OK.

I know these are everywhere here and a little over used maybe but they make a great shade, create privacy, grow fast, and are evergreen. I have another corner of my backyard I would love to have a couple but they would block the sun from my winter palms and I can't have that.

I posted some photos of my palms under the thread: Hello from Little Elm.

BILL MA · Post by **BILL MA** » Fri Oct 16, 2009 6:29 pm

Thanks Rocky

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 6:49 pm

Bill,
sorry about that omission. My name is Erik.
Rocky,
that's interesting that your live oak is from Tri B in Hulbert, OK. I drive through their fields along highway 51 east of Tulsa regularly for work. It is a truly huge nursery in the foothills of the Ozark mountains. It is slightly colder there than here. For instance, they got down to 30 oF this morning while it was 34 oF here, south of Tulsa and at just 700' above sea level. So, I think it is safe to assume a Tri B live oak would be quite hardy.
I was too busy in Ft. Worth to arrange a visit or to make it to Dallas. We made a brief stop in a garden center on our way out of town this morning. We bought two trunkless 5 gallon Sabal texana (I think Francko [2003] refers to them as S. mexicana) and a 5 gallon T. fortunei with a small trunk. They'll spend the winter indoors and go in the ground in May.
My wife fell in love with a 8' tall queen palm in a 5 gallon pot that was cheap. No way it would fit in the car. We are in Texas with a truck and horse trailer every now and then. I promised her I'd get it next time if it was still there. Yes, it would live in a pot, albeit a much larger one.
I'll be searching for information on Sabal as it is new to me. I brought home some Sabal minor seeds I found in a Ft. Worth city park. I'll try to germinate them.

rgrin1 · Post by **rgrin1** » Sun Oct 18, 2009 7:57 pm

Erik,
The Sabal Minor seeds will germinate easy. I know there are many methods for seed germination. I have pulled seeds from various Sabal Minors around here and just stuck them in house plant pots within the house that already contains a plant and the seeds would germinate. I believe you will find the Sabal texana to be more robust than the Washingtonia's. They are for me anyway. I have a small one and I have never provided it any protection in the winter and it does great. There are places north of me that have streets lined with them.

Rocky

TerdalFarm · Post by **TerdalFarm** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:30 pm

Do you scrape the fruit off of the seeds? Do you scar the seeds? Do you soak them? Am I making this out to be harder than it needs to be?

Knnn · Post by **Knnn** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 6:46 pm

With fresh seed, just soak them overnight to rehydrate. All you have to do then is squeeze between your fingers to pop the seed out (sort of like a grape

No need to scarify, you could soak for another day after cleaning just to make sure the germination inhibitors are leached out.
Bag them up with some dampened moss & leave somewhere warm, you should see results in 1-3 months.

Like Rocky said, you could also just spread some around and see good results (I start most everything inside during the winter to get a jump start on spring)

Steve

rgrin1 · Post by **rgrin1** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 6:40 am

No. I have read about these methods online. I have never personally tried these. I just stick them in a pot and have pretty good luck. But the seeds are very fresh and maybe that helps. The fruit that falls from my jelly palm gerinates in the mulch areound the tree with no effort on my part, but seeds I order online does not germinate as easily so I assume it has to do with the freshness of the seed.

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