Outside protection Zone 6 - 2011

Discuss greenhouse related topics and outside weather protection methods.

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oppalm
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Post by oppalm » Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:05 am

(Does the water freeze? If not, that should help moderate temps in the microclimate.[/quote])

The water very rarely will freeze over. we have a bubbler in dock wells to keep it from freezing solid around the dock, as
a precaution. I agree that the water may produce a little warmer micro-climate. The trade off is there is no protection from a north wind for this particular palm tee. The wind from the north comes across water and smacks it pretty hard.

Barb, this is the Ozarks, its perfectly acceptable to tie trash bags down. Nobody cares. I do worry about a dog or a raccoon digging into the bag looking for food. Of course I worry about alot of stuff, for example, I worry if the elastic band in the top of my socks will give out.

The beauty of having palm trees at the lake is I have 2 sets of neighbors that think I'm nuts growing palm trees in the midwest.


Kent in Kansas
where it's cold in winter (always)
and hot in summer (usually)
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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:06 am

a dog or a raccoon digging into the bag looking for food. Of course I worry about alot of stuff, for example, I worry if the elastic band in the top of my socks will give out.
Dogs/raccoons will dig IF they smell food, your bag will be safe all winter with only leaves inside.

...my sock elastic, not so much. Just meteorites. :roll:

What would we do without your humor, Kent!
:lol:
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oppalm
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Post by oppalm » Wed Dec 14, 2011 7:08 am

getting a little anxious to see if my thermocube is going to work this year. I have a 20F-30F (-16C--1C) thermocube in my palm hut and we have not had temps below like 25F this year yet. Even our 10 day forecst shows our lowest temp at 25F (about -3C). Weather has been fairly mild so far in winter 2011. I hope our streak continues. I guess only time will tell.
Kent in Kansas
where it's cold in winter (always)
and hot in summer (usually)
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Wed Dec 14, 2011 8:20 am

My town is promised to be cold spelled down to minus 26C on the December 19-20-21th. There is no heater inside of my "the palm-hayloft". What is a critical T min inside it to be worried?
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Paul Ont
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Post by Paul Ont » Wed Dec 14, 2011 11:39 am

Igor- What types of palms are we talking about and how established are they? Both of these factors are key!

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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Wed Dec 14, 2011 5:16 pm

Paul, I have two Trachycarpus - fortunei and wagnerianus. Planted outside last spring.
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hardyjim
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Post by hardyjim » Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:14 am

igor.glukhovtsev wrote:My town is promised to be cold spelled down to minus 26C on the December 19-20-21th. There is no heater inside of my "the palm-hayloft". What is a critical T min inside it to be worried?

Once you begin to approach the mid teens a lot of cold hardy palms begin to suffer...
it only gets worse from there,I would say single digits will be cause for alarm.


Mostly talking about Chamaerops,Butia and Trachys here.......
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:22 am

Thanks, Jim There is minus 8C (18F?) outside and 2.5C (36F?) inside of the protection "house".
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oppalm
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Post by oppalm » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:10 am

minus 26C. BRRRRRRRRRRRRRR. I think you would need to keep the temps above -17C (0F) to have any chance of survival. Having said that, I think each cold spell brings its own challenges, the three day duration will also take its toll on your newly planted trachys. good luck winter can be unforgiving sometimes. Thank goodnes you have them protected.
Kent in Kansas
where it's cold in winter (always)
and hot in summer (usually)
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Tue Dec 20, 2011 7:20 am

We got minus 20 C last night finally. The minimum temp inside of the palmhouse was minus 4.3 C. The max temp outside - minus 14 C and minus 3.2 C inside. Not too bad, isn't it?
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Godfryd
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Post by Godfryd » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:13 am

very good result!
Keep exoting!
Godfryd

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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:21 am

Very effective protection, Igor.
Good job.

BRRRR that's cold...stay warm and safe
:bigsmurf:

Barb
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:18 am

Barb, I'd try! By the way I've got some virus in UK, so today was a first day I would be able come back to work. That's why I didn't start rooting various Aucuba cuttings that brought from London. Checked them today it seems they are fine..
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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 9:40 am

Igor, how awful that you got sick from that nice vacation in London...glad you're feeling better now.

Good luck with the cuttings.
Curious: would Aucuba cuttings in Spring be better than Fall cuttings?
Or do their cuttings need a woody stem (versus soft growth) to root?

Barb
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:16 am

Barb, thanks for wishing all these good things. I promise everything is gonna be alright.
As for aucuba's cuttings unlikely I would have a chance coming back to London for them in spring... I do remember my only Aucuba plant has been growing from a cutting had been stolen in Leningrad Scientific library in December 1991. Yes, I know I was a bad boy but the plant is 1.5 m high and healthy. But it is a male plant. I'd like to have some Aucuba plants with their beautiful red berries. That's why I I cut last season tops from three different variegation form of the female plants and collected some seeds from them just in case. And I do hope the cutting will be successfully rooting until spring comes. By the way my 20 yeas old Aucuba has no woody stem parts at all.
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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:28 am

I know I was a bad boy
Nope, we've all done that.
Just think of the species we would all have if palms gave viable "cuttings"... :bounce:
tops from three different variegation form of the female plants and collected some seeds from them just in case. And I do hope the cutting will be successfully rooting
I've had luck with using rooting hormone powder, you probably use that too.

Your 20 year old plant has NO woody stems?
Wow, I thought they turned to wood after two years.
Amazing plant if it survives hard winters with soft green stems.

And the berries are beautiful. http://www.paghat.com/aucuba.html

Barb
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:28 am

Very good reference! Please remind me to take a close shot of my Aucuba plant stem in April :lol:
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oppalm
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Post by oppalm » Wed Dec 21, 2011 10:24 am

Hey Igor , how do you cover your palms and how do you keep them warm? Sounds like by the temps in your palmhuts you got this protection thingy figured out. Good for you.
Kent in Kansas
where it's cold in winter (always)
and hot in summer (usually)
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:44 am

Kent, I did nothing special but... My two Trachy palms shelter has three walls build from wheat straw bales 90x50x40 centimeters, the fourth shelter wall is a wall of my house. I put two layers of the rock-wool as a roof. And one layer of the rock-wool on each side. Plus plastic layer. There is a vent hole inside. This is the only "heat" source in there.
A minimum temperature in the shelter was minus 5,4 c so far. A diurnal variation of outside temperature you can find here http://weatherspark.com/#!graphs;a=Kazakhstan/Almaty.
Thanks for asking... And only palms would tell us if the palms shelter would have been enough effective make them surviving.

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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:19 am

I wish a Merry Christmas and a Happy New year to everyone! Our Orthodox Christmas is coming up soon, January the7th.

By the way today was a first day with a max t outside above 0C after a really long and harsh cold spell (11 days). A temperature inside of my palmhouse raised above 0C too.
I think a pretty good result of protection efficiency has been achieved so far.
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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Sat Dec 24, 2011 7:06 am

Thank you, Igor.
A very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you too.

Glad you're getting a reprieve from the cold.
Great protection job!
No wonder your palms look so good.

Barb
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Sat Dec 24, 2011 7:51 am

I don't know how the palms will be looking in April. Just reminding this is their first winter out there...
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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Sat Dec 24, 2011 4:43 pm

The protection temps sounded pretty good, so you can be optimistic about your work.

Barb
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kcpalms
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Post by kcpalms » Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:10 pm

Hey OPPalm, how about this nice winter so far in our area? Over here in Raytown my palms have only been down to 20F once so far! Along my south wall/foundation the lowest temp has been 27f! I have not supplied any heat yet; a few more months to go though. :wink:

Good luck over there!

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oppalm
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Post by oppalm » Wed Jan 04, 2012 6:49 am

you are so right kcpalms. our winter has been nice so far. I have 2 of my palms on a 20F/30F thermocube with heat and it has not turned on yet. Its just a matter of time at this point.

just so the rest of the people know, kcpalms and oppalm are about 15 miles apart. kcpalms lives on the east side of kansas city and I (oppalm) live on the south west side of the city.
Kent in Kansas
where it's cold in winter (always)
and hot in summer (usually)
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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Wed Jan 04, 2012 7:54 am

Nice that you two palm fanatics live so close, Kent.

I forgot how far away KNNN (Steve) is from you, but he's not around much any more. :cry:

Enjoy your non-winter, guys!
Barb
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:55 am

Since outside temperature was above freezing today I was having a change checking my palms inside of the shelter... They look fine, knock on wood!

Image

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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:58 am

They look fabulous, Igor.
Great colour, robust leaves.
Like they haven't seen any cold at all.

Well done!

Barb
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Sat Jan 14, 2012 9:03 am

:salute: :salute: :salute:
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Godfryd
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Post by Godfryd » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:42 pm

good to see them at fine condition!
Keep exoting!
Godfryd

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sashaeffer
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Another fine mild Nebraska January winter day....

Post by sashaeffer » Sun Jan 22, 2012 1:18 pm

Discovered one of the pots of mumm's are blooming in the green house and enjoying the temps in there.


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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Sun Jan 22, 2012 6:37 pm

Wow nice temps for you this time of year.
Fingers crossed!

Barb
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sashaeffer
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Post by sashaeffer » Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:28 pm

Yes, we've had it easy so far. Do you get that much different of weather where your at than the Seattle area? Like in a lot of snow usually?
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lucky1
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Post by lucky1 » Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:34 pm

Scott,
Our temps on the interior "mesa" are more like Spokane WA temps but not as much rain.
Actually closer to Idaho in temps/rainfall (right Aaron?)

We're about 1200 feet above sea level, and in a rain shadow.
Only get 12 or 13 inches precip annually.

Northern tip of Canada's only desert (as John says).
Hotter than the hubs of hell in summer with strong winds. :|

Barb

PS--sorry I forgot you already HAVE a weather sticker!!!!
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sashaeffer
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Post by sashaeffer » Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:37 pm

Yea, just added it a few minutes ago.
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:49 am

Checked my palms today. Seems they look OK after 2 weeks of non-stopping frost inside of the palm-hut. They've seen minus 9.2C.

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sashaeffer
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Post by sashaeffer » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:51 am

Nice pics! always nice to see and know they are doing well during the winter.
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igor.glukhovtsev
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Post by igor.glukhovtsev » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:53 am

:salute:
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hardyjim
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Post by hardyjim » Sun Jan 29, 2012 7:46 am

Looking good Igor!!! :cyclops:
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oppalm
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springtime update

Post by oppalm » Mon Mar 19, 2012 1:05 pm

thought I would show you the springtime 2012 pics of my palm trees that I overwinter outside.

I took the protection of these palms on 3/17/2012. first up is the palms on the north side of my house. these palms are protected with just leaves jammed in a 1X2 frame and covered with plastic. no heat. Our low for the winter was around 4F or -15C. They look better than I expected.. Check them out below. These are the same palms that are in post 1 on page 1 of this thread.

Image
Kent in Kansas
where it's cold in winter (always)
and hot in summer (usually)
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